Officiating football today with Mike D’ambrosio
52 min readOfficiating football today with Mike D’ambrosio
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[Music] All right we're Back seems like it's been long why why Does it seem like it's been long did we Have somebody on last Friday because we Went from Thursday to Friday we went What we had somebody on at Thursday oh Thursday who okay Coach time time's moving so fast all Right today today's GNA be a great great One we're gonna talk we're GNA change it Up a little bit um talk a little bit of Officiating which is always a Hot Topic In one way shape or form so um thankless Job oh as thankless job as it Gets necessary but necessary 100% Probably one the most Underrated aspects of the game or what We do in terms of just having officials That are on the same page that Understand the process like it is a I Mean I you couldn't pay me enough to do That G there's no doubt it's definitely a uh Um it it's it's a it's always Controversial you're never right you're Just never right and we got a no better Person than to talk about this than Mike D Ambrosia who is a longtime official um He has tremendous experience in this Area uh he's been an athlete himself Obviously he's officiated for a long Time and so uh we're gonna talk about All these topics and then some let's
Bring them on right now what's going on Mike hey good morning guys how are you Hey Mike how are you man appreciate you Coming on taking the time no no thank You having me I like that whistle talk In the background gotot it what what Does it say underneath I can't see it Inside the mind of a football official It's there it is is that a book no That's my podcast oh that's your podcast Oh perfect oh gosh I gotta take I gotta Get a listed over there on that um I've I've had a couple good guests so far got A couple couple of them lined up so had Uh had Danny Garrett on just recently Too so I know you guys spoken with Danny Before yep yep absolutely we had we had Danny Garrett on um yeah we can't forget We can't forget him oh yeah yeah let Before we dive into all of this what why Don't you give everybody a background Officiating sports playing all that kind Of stuff so so we get a good background On you and then go from there sure sure So uh I'm plug in Danny because uh Danny And I actually were college teammates Together and actually roommates back in College back at uh back at Monclair State uh yeah go Red Hawks So so I actually uh I my my college Career kind of got cut short I had a Couple injuries I was told that I had Injured my neck and so I actually Stopped co uh stopped playing um on my
Own valtion and Coach uh Coach G at 21 Years old offered me a coaching position So I actually started coaching at Montclair and ironically I was Danny's Coach his last year his senior year he And I were still roommates and I was Coaching him so it was it was an Interesting Dynamic to say Le different Dynamic right there that's for sure yeah Uh positive as I was coaching tight end So Danny was still on the defensive side He just you know beating the [ __ ] out of The tight end every SP that's F pretty Much but uh so yeah I got into coaching Right right away and I coached at Monclair for three years uh then I Jumped with Coach Billy Johnson toic And I was Off oh you had you had moose on I didn't Realize that awesome Dave got the Understanding of the moose thing so now He gets it right oh that's right Moose all right Mo so uh yeah I I got The coach at pic Valley with Billy for a Couple years uh he allowed me to be the Offensive coordinator and special teams Coordinator there with them um but then My my family kind of brought me back to Uh to where I was back in Mammoth County Where I grew up um so I moved back down To Mammoth County started coaching and Teaching in Mammoth County uh bounced Around a little bit was at fre Township At
Marboro um got to coach at Mammoth Regional at Bobby aasta um and then I Finished up coaching at barnegate Because I was living in the area but Again now I have kids the the the Coaching aspect was starting to get to Be a little bit too much with the Commute with the Summers and everything Like that uh so I retired from coaching From coaching uh High School sports I Should say because now I'm coaching my Kids sports and uh so I had all the Background of coaching and yelling at The officials and thinking I knew Everything about the sport um and I was Approached at my school by another Official saying hey you we're always Looking for people that that know the Sport that are involved that know how to Deal with kids that you're a teacher Have you ever thought about officiating And I'm like are you crazy heck no and I Heard your guys intro for the same Reasons I'm like it's a thankless job But then I sat back and I was thinking I'm like well this is a a great way for Me to stay involved in the sport that I Love I again I thought I knew everything At the time you know like all coaches um So I decided to take the class and uh Here I am eight years later uh working On uh a great crew got to work a state Championship game uh this past uh fall Uh working a couple semi-final games got
Some big games and uh and having some Fun getting to see from a different Perspective yeah so that that's and That's a background thing that I think Um a lot of people don't realize that The the playing background usually Precludes a lot a lot of guys coming Into officiating so right you know the The uh one of the myths of uh of of Coaches on officials is that they don't Know anything about the game you know What I mean that they're just Officiating on the rules right and and They don't know actually how it all Works but that's actually not true that Most most officials play played the game Um and uh and that's one of the kind of Myths of of of of officiating talk talk About Um kind of some of I mean there's a lot We could cover on this but but talk About some of the things that that you See going on in officiating that um from The time you started eight years ago to Now that are maybe rule changes or I Mean we we'll we'll get to the NFL thing Which we definitely want to talk about Because that's a Hot Topic and T but but Some of the things that you guys have Really had to evolve with from an Officiating Standpoint well I mean from being an old School player and Coach I mean you guys Can relate to uh what our old highlight
Films used to be with Blindside blocks And stuff like that I mean heck we we Were taught on kickoffs uh coming Cutting across the field and kind of Head hunting for somebody so that's Probably That role with the defenseless receiver With the Blindside blocks and stuff like That I'm actually I was just uh looking Over looking through the book Again it was probably the toughest thing For me as an official Because being in the stands being on the Sidelines I was always like oh great Block and now it's not a great block That's kind of what people want to see You know it's it's crazy what I wanted To see yeah I mean you remember want to See right I mean it's just not around Anymore they look at old school I mean Even not that long ago right like you're Looking at highlights I mean you would Set up the wall on a punt return and Look to take that guy right out on a Blind side block or a crackback block Right a receiver coming down and Cracking on an end and things of that Nature like it's just not part of the Game Anymore yeah and I mean at fir it took Me a while to to to get used to it and To truly set my Minds frame uh in that Aspect but ultimately it is for the Safety of the kids and that's that is
What what our our main objective is I Mean we talk about it on our crew our Main objective is to spot the ball and Keep the game going we want the game to Be clean we want it to be run Efficiently but we ultimately want the Kids to be safe so and that is a rule That with with the size and speed now And you guys are seeing it with with all The recruiting the size and the speed Now it it's absurd of how big and fast These kids are again compared to when we Were playing Um so for the safety aspect I do agree With the rule um it's just it's still Has a lot of human element in it was the Person facing them uh was he able to Defend himself was the receiver uh have An opportunity to to regain control uh We we had an a situation uh with a hit On a defenseless receiver where they're Trying not to go low but the kid never Got to the ground he got his legs taken Out from underneath them and we had to Call that penalty because he he came Down violently and again that was what We used to teach as coaches bigger Receiver chop him down like a tree um But now we got to look at it from a Different perspective from the safety Aspect and and I know coach jman you Mentioned uh we're GNA touch on the NFL One I I I I I don't know where they're Going now to be honest with you with
That with the new rule I I it's gonna be Flag football soon it seems like uh Almost with with some of the rules that They're Implementing but yeah I got to say The Blind Side block and and that crack Black Block were probably the most Difficult ones for me to to set my mind Straight on and say all right that's now A foul I Gotta Throw That one like the Holding penalties the false starts those Those are the easy ones um but it's it's Those big 15 yard penalties now too you Don't want to throw them because they Are Drive Killers but again it's all About the safety of the kids we're we're Ultimately there to make sure that the Kids have a great experience have fun Learn the game in a safe envir or in the Safest environment because it's it's not A safe environment at all that's just Not the game no it is still it is still A violent contact sport right% what What's what's interesting so like the Crackpack block for example Um when so like a guy comes back and the Guy turns and he can't see him you can't You obviously you can't you know uh lay Into him now if he turns and he sees you Are you allowed to put hands on him so Are you allowed to um so that that's Always that's always the gray area in That that one right like so I turn back I turn back he now comes forward am I
Able to put my hands on him and that That's that that was always I always Thought that was always the touchy one Because like you teach your kids like Okay you can't like you can't you know Shoulder him you can't do any of that Kind but if you you put hands on now That the issue is he has to obviously Fully 100% see you right because Otherwise he he probably gets lifted off The ground even on on the handson right Yeah so and that is where the gray area Is the big one that we're so how we're Taught to look at it and it typically is Going to happen on a broken play on a Kick return different things like that Where you got somebody going back and Forth sideline to sideline right it's Initially now when we see somebody Heading back towards their own goal line That's our trigger all right we gotta we Gotta keep an eye on this one Um if they if they set a pick if they Just get their body in front we got Nothing like that that that's exactly That's exactly what they're looking for But um and Coach you were saying hands Up even if it's hands up that's still a Clean block right even if they kind of Extend their hands it's when they're Lowering the shoulder and the old school Ear hole in somebody that's that's where We have the flag but again Um we we try to throw that flag uh with
A little bit of a delay we want to Process what we saw first we we want to See it process it was it open hands and Then throw the flag so sometimes that Flag people are screaming and yelling at Us oh you threw that flag like five Minutes late it's no we're trying to Make sure that we have it correctly and And and again I I had one recently in a Game where where I threw it play ended I Immediately went I'm now I'm an Umpire Um for the most part I'm in the middle Of the field uh same type of broken play Was actually a screen pass um and the Offensive lineman peeled back and and Got somebody and after I threw it I Immediately went to my side judge and my Back judge and say hey did you guys see What I saw I said and we talked about it Before we reported it to our referee to Signal it but I I saw it I processed it I just wanted to make sure that maybe I Missed open hands or anything like that But they we all had the same thing so Coach wasn't happy with it but again it Was it was the safety of the player so He lowered his shoulder into him no that Makes sense and then a lot of the things That you see like um you know it's Interesting because when obviously Concussions became an issue they Obviously want you know you're taking Away helmet to helmet uh those kind of Things targeting and then um now you
Have an issue I guess with which which Which they're starting they're Addressing now um where guys are going Low so you know they were going high People were getting head injuries right Now they're going low people are getting Knee injuries and Ankle injuries and Those kind of injuries right so it's It's one of those things where uh you Know so you went from you went from you Know bite the ball wrap up you know uh Drive through the guy in the old days Used to be almost down the middle right When you you were you were tackling them Um to now everything's below the hip for The most part as much as possible below The hip uh hip and below and um that Created a different set of injuries Right where kids legs are getting caught Not just obviously all the way up to the NFL right their legs get caught right Underneath them they they they tear a Knee they they roll they they roll an Ankle bad they break an ankle right Those kind of things lower leg injuries Have become I I I don't I haven't looked At the stats before this but my guess is That it's gone through the roof so um Lower leg injuries because because of The the switching of where the tackling Lies right because you said still a Violent game right it's just you're Shifting the violent from one area to The next right correct so so before we
Talk about the hip drop part talk about How like are are you are you seeing a Situation where you have to officiate Some of that stuff now like you Mentioned the CH the uh taking down the Big tight end that's really tall on so Is that something that now is is much More afficiated Too uh it is but I got to say um we the Trickle down effect at the high school Level uh I was recently just talking Somebody at the college level and we Were talking about with the targeting Rule about the ejections and stuff like That he he was adamant against and I Understand that um but because we're the Third level I think it is getting taught Earlier on the proper tackling technique Um right so we're not seeing as much of That we're not seeing as much as the Spearing anymore we're not seeing as Much as the helmet I mean the helmet to Helmet contact again that's that's kind Of a gray area because you got your Running backs dropping levels and Different things like that so that That's also a very difficult one um but The the tackling aspect of it and and And The Blind Side hits I think for the Most part the the high school kids are Getting it it's being taught at an Earlier age and hopefully we'll start Seeing that trickle up with with the Teaching coming at the lower level and
Going up so at the high school level it Hasn't in my opinion it hasn't been too Bad it was addressed um it was a point Of emphasis a couple years ago coaches Didn't like it but now I think the Coaches are more accepting of it and and Hopefully teaching it the right way but Yeah now now we're getting away from They're they're talking with uh the old Pete Carol tackling technique now with The gator rap and roll rap and roll yes It's literally what's taught that's just What's taught right and and I think Now because concussions are such a big Deal and you know a couple years ago it Was almost like football was like this Might not be around in five years you Know like that was the level of I think like fear that was imposed or or Put on people and now because of that I Feel like tackling is taught at the Younger levels with more of an emphasis On the correct way to do it right like Youth coaches have to you know there's a Lot of that kind of going into it so now That's just the way they've always Learned you don't have that kind of Where you were switching from some Coaches teach and bite the ball right to Now almost across the board everybody's Going with your eyes through the thighs Rap and roll that type of thing I think That's just where the high school has Gone now these guys don't even know the
Other way to tackle right because they Were never that that's just they were Just never taught it it was just a time Thing that you know it had to process Through and is the Rapp and rooll like My question on the rap and roll is is That I I get it safer from a head Standpoint I get it 100% but is that Overall safer on a body St from a body Standpoint right like well would you Rather use your head or would you rather Use your shoulder no I well I I well I'd Rather you know um pull a flag I I no I Look at it like this like bite the ball To me was safer you know face your head Is out outside the body okay you're not On the you're not you're not putting Your listen when I first in the 90s we Were taught to wrap up head up right Down the middle of them obviously right By the time I got to college we were Really taught to we were using that but We were Now using bite the ball right Get your head outside even in the 90s Right because it was a more efficient Tackle right so I how many times you Gonna miss right right but my point my Point is this with rap and roll rap and Roll Like there like because I teach it with Young kids it's it's like people's legs Get caught underneath themselves all all The time with rap roll I see it oh You're thinking from an offensive
Perspective getting Hurt from a yeah I'm talking about from An offensive perspective oh yeah I mean I'm talking about defense 100% well I Mean that's what we were talking about With mostly for concussions I mean yes Defensive players get get hurt at Concussions too but they still can get Hurt no matter how they're tackling but It was be offensive players that were Getting knocked out that was the biggest Issue receivers coming across the middle And someone laying them out defenseless Receivers what what I'm talking about With the rapid roll is it's a first of All I don't think it's a very efficient Way of tackling so there's a whole bunch Of uh things that go into it because It's near hip and and you know as the Most efficient way to tackling everyone Ha hates when I say this most efficient Way of tackling is get your shoulders Across the person okay head on the Outside whether it's at their hip or Their lower part lower and and legs Where wherever it is even even stomach Area and and get across and wrap them And grab cloth from behind that's the Most efficient way to tackle them um and It it's the most efficient way to get Him down and probably in my opinion the Safest way for both people now obviously When you come uphead I agree yeah you Start to come up higher obviously that
Becomes dangerous for both people Obviously right that U and obviously When you go way low it becomes dangerous Now it's not as dangerous for the Defensive player but now it becomes Dangerous for the offensive player with Knees and those kind of things so that's Where I think the P Carol thing was uh a Um a a step in the right direction but Not the complete solution and what you Found what happened because of this this Is why you have hip drop right the hip Drop issue is because of rap and roll so They're rapping and they're rolling and They can't get them down so in order to Get them down they drop their hip that's Why it's become a thing and that's why I I agree like Old School uh thought Process again getting your head across Like you're talking about but when You're seeing the the rap and roll They're stopping their feet and we're We're we're teaching everybody keep your Legs driving keep your legs driving but Now all of a sudden we're teaching them To stop their feet and now that's Turning into the hip drop where if You're getting your head across and Running through the the the player worst Case scenario is you're stopping forward Progress and the play is going to be Over even if you don't bring the person Down so I'm I'm still teaching that at At my son's level it's a 12-year-old
Youth Level of getting across and Getting your feet going because the the Rap and roll it turns into a hand an arm Tackle and again talking about the size And the speed of the kids today you got 225 pound running backs that are running Right through it I mean heck you got 215 Pound wide receivers that are running Right through it because their their Legs are so powerful that if you're not Running your legs you're you're not Stopping them and that again turns into The all right let me grab them and drop Down and it's almost I mean I understand The rule that they put in and why they Put it in because basically the tackle Has turned into a horse collar tackle Where you're pulling it back and you Were seeing those horse collar injuries Y um but again it's it's taking away the Nature of the game in Essence of how to teach it properly Again if you're teaching them to to to Keep their head out of the way get it Across the body uh and run their legs And keep their legs going you're you're Gonna take away a good amount of the Injuries the other thing that I thought Was which is interesting Is and because you coach youth you you See it more in youth because when you When you go and they haven't learned all These skills yet right so keeping their Head up is a problem at the youth area
So when you teach rap and roll what do All of them do they all put their head Down right y all of them it's just it's Just a n when you go to rap and roll When you're going that way as a kid your Head goes down okay it's it's correct we Really have to overemphasize to get them To keep their head up so what what I Like I watched a lot of rugby stuff Right like yes they rrap and roll as a I've noticed as a finishing Last Resort Meaning they go they go through they run Their feet all the way through the body And then they roll as a last resort Because most of the time what I've seen The rugby guys do is whether near hip or Across they just keep running their feet All the way through the hip and that That's really their main goal is to take Him down in that fashion they they roll When it becomes a situation where They're finishing and they can't finish Right and then I've seen them roll and I've watched a lot of rugby rug like um You know they have actually you can find It all over to YouTube right these guys Like the the All Blacks you know and in New New Zealand they have all these like Teaching clinics that they have as as How they show their their the way they Tackle and stuff and they teach them Also with the pad right the pad is up Here they hold the pad and very few People do this they hold the pad and the
Guy comes through the hip right so they Get like all the basic Le they work Through all the levels and it's so Interesting to me because what until I Started looking at that because when I Started coaching like when I was Coaching High School I was teaching Rapp Roll you know we're going and when I Started to teach youth I what was Bothering me was the kids were putting Their head down and I was like how can I Fix this because we would do the drills That we would do in high school where The high school kids were able to handle It and the youth kids were putting the Head down I'm like shoot this is this is Not good so we backed it up and we we we Started working through all that kind of Thing to make sure they got their head Up and I think that's a huge thing that As you're teaching teach attch now from A rule Standpoint um Obviously do you Think Hip drop is g to become something In the high school level is that g to Be do you even see It not that I'm aware of I'll be honest With you I I I don't recall seeing that Tackle at our level um it's a it's a It's a pro type of thing it's an Athletic thing too I mean you got these Guys just don't have the how many times It's very rare right that in high school
You have a guy and then you know like a Running back and you're like he makes a Move and now your linebacker's holding On and now he's gotta pull him back Which is kind of what the hip tackle is At that point the whistle is probably Blown for you know stoppage of play and Guys are stalemated it's over or you Have somebody else coming in to clean it Up before that actually happens y so I just I don't know I don't think I can Recall ever seeing it where I would be Like yo that's a hip like you know like You saw horse collar tackles right yeah Horse collar tackles and they modified The horse collar tackle too recently About being on the side too so but it's Still got to be that P that backwards Pull to the ground um and also it's now The the name plate too so it's not just Through the collar anymore it's in the Name plate again to prevent that but With the hip drop I I can't honestly say That I've actually seen it in a high School game now that doesn't mean that I It was something that I wasn't looking For so was not not a foul not nothing Like that so and Especially position right that umpire Position is where I would think you Would see that more so yeah yep and Again I mean we're we're still behind You're talking about Derek like from Behind like like on the side right like
Running back he's making a play right He's going outside trying to get to the Numbers right now he makes a cut he Comes back inside and as a linebacker I'm going to fit him up coming inside Out and now maybe I slip to the outside And I kind of give a pull to get him Down because now if I don't his forward Progress is still going you know what I Mean yeah so I just think High School Guys are just Contin and look the way I Teach it is always look you run your Feet five steps after contact right like I don't want you to just hit him and Stop I want you to go through his body Right and push him back so I I just Think that you know it is something That's I just think it's more of a pro Type of thing the guys at this level I Mean look they some are athletic like That wonder I don't know I don't know Because you know what I I think what Mike said might be true you're not Looking for it so if you're not looking For it like they got enough to worry Honestly I didn't even know there was Helmet to helmet until it became a rule Like like I didn't even Real I didn't realize it was going on That much like in my head I think oh Maybe it was once a game you know man Playing safety bro I'm trying to take Your head off yeah yeah but I until it Became a rule I didn't even really think
About it I couldn't played today I Couldn't play this have more 15 yarders I'd be gone like I'm telling you I I Would be gone first quarter first Quarter I probably cost myself seven Interceptions in college because I just Want to light somebody up like that's What I was I'm sorry like I played this Game because it was physical and I loved It like that's what the the the hitting Aspect was the appeal for me you know Like it was I had as a safety I had a 12 Yard running Head Start bro to light you Up and it was coming whether it was Whether we were going High I mean I Wasn't trying to hit you in the head and Take your head off but and especially in College being a smaller guy all the time Like I had to go low so and that was Like pre hurdle era you know and that's Another rule that's insane that I I I Drives me crazy like a guy jumps over Somebody some guys throw the flag and It's like you can't do that and then Another guy you got jumps over him and Now he's good to go that rule was Explain that rule explain That that rle explain thatle we're Putting you on the spot with Some yeah yeah that's fine that's fine Uh and again that happen maybe twice Three times a year Yeah no I actually had had one coach Upset with me because I didn't call a
Hurdling call um in the in the middle of The pile it was actually on an extra Point uh a linebacker went the hurdle Over the center but the rule is if only Have two feet on the ground you can't Hurdle them So I'm trying to think of the easiest Way to explain it so if if I'm if I'm a Defensive back going for a tackle and I Go low and my feet are still on the Ground but my hands not on the ground I I can't hurdle him because what they're Afraid of is not only uh not not the not Only the Antonio Brown scenario with the Punter where he came in cleat first on The punter just kicked him in the chest Yeah but it's more so they're afraid of The back themselves it's actually for The backs themselves of getting flipped Over and Landing head first so it's Still a very great area if the guy is Launching himself down to the ground and They've got a body part a hand a forearm Their knee is on the ground technically You can hurdle that but it's Brian Leonard was the one bringing it to Fame In the Jersey area with the Leonard leap And stuff like that the Leonard leap but Uh yeah so that that is one that we Don't see too often because again Um it's just something that that is Taught it's something that I've caught More so in scrimmages preseason and I'll Go over to the kids I I'll drop the flag
I'm like listen son that is a hell of an Athletic play yeah but you can't do it Unfortunately so try you put that on Your highlight tape but just make sure You blank out the flag part oh yeah yep No we we I've actually seen that on some Kids Instagram and uh Twitter pages Recruting look saquon Barkley started You know what I mean it's what these Guys see yeah so and again it it's it's A safety type of thing um but but it's It's a gray area because it's also one Of those things that when it happens It's like whoa that just happened like You're not anticipating that and like a Hold you can kind of see getting set up You're you're watching The Grind there Uh even like I said that blinds side Block you you we have our triggers of When we see somebody going back towards Their own goal line um but that hurdling Rule it's it's few and far between it Doesn't happen too often um but yeah Again it's more so for the s Of the back themselves as opposed to the Tackler well even like the tackler right Like I just feel like look if you're Going to go jump and now you're gonna Launch yourself you may catch that knee Right under the chin or right to the Helmet as you're doing that but I mean I Would have been hurdled prob a thousand Times I swear to God because I used to Go so low they didn't even have to
Hurdle right because that guy was always Bigger than me so take the legs out run Through right even like if a guy's in The air push his legs to flip them like You got do whatever you got do it's just So different like and that was just one Of those rules I mean Dave I remember When we were coaching at rbr was our First scrimmage like one of the kids did It and we were like that was a great Play and they dropped the flag explained It okay cool like now we get it right Yeah fene I remember him y he went right Over I was like whoa yeah it was like we Were like whoa and then the rest were Like okay let's figure this one out Right like let's figure this one out but I was like wow this kid's pretty pretty Athletic better get have the ball Yeah's only a junior too we're good um But I just listen one of the things for Me is I just don't understand why Coaches okay everybody makes mistakes Everybody blows calls the harping on it What does that do have I ever seen a ref Pick up a flag and change a call so like Why are you gonna sit there and wreck This guy on our sideline who probably Didn't even throw the flag to begin with And you're just going to keep crushing Him play after play after play on Something that happened five plays ago Like what are we doing that's where us As coaches are so wrong I just don't
Understand that part of it so I'll give You guys a great example of that and and I agree with you 100% uh a big game this year I'm not Going to name schools but we we had a Really big game this year and it was a Competitive game and on a kickoff we had An inadvertent whistle which is the yeah It is it is by far the worst thing that We can do like we our pregame we every Pregame and we're crew of six that we're Always together and our head head Official our crew chief always talks About it keep the whistles deep keep the Flags deep like let's make sure we see The play End technically by rule the Play ends itself it's not ending on a Whistle the whistle is just after the Play is over so that's why we're very Big with okay we're and we you if you Come to one of our games you're probably Only going to hear one whistle we're not Blowing the whistle all around the field It's just the person got got that play But we had an inadvertent whistle and Our guy owned up to it we came together As a crew we talked about it and said Some explo lives in in our own referee Huddle it and uh killing me bro you're Killing me my myself and and the head Referee had to go to both Sidelines and Explain happened and the coach of the Team that it hurt had some explo lives But then he's like all right let's let's
Go let's play football and from that Point on he did not say boo about it he Understood we screwed up we made a Mistake it was a human error it was a Bad mistake um but we made the error we Owned up to it and from that point on we Just played football and we officiated The same way the whole time the head Coach did not say anything to us the Remainder of the game he moved on from It it was a special teams play Unfortunately the special teams coach Every time there was a pun kickoff or Anything was sitting there screaming and Yelling oh here it comes again I'm we're Like coach come on like we understand Yeah we we screwed up and uh we're also I mean we're not big into we're not Doing the makeup calls like we're that's Not I got to officiate there so now I Gotta go get this one for this guy a lot Of guys do that like you know like Especially if now a coach is all over You for that call now you almost feel Like all right I just want to shut him Up so let me give a call you know and I Think that's where us as coaches can Change the whole narrative because in Reality like you're not the enemy some Of these coaches I feel like look at Referees like they're the enemy or he's Out to get me or he like they just don't Like us or it's it's because of who we Are how about you just worry about your
Team be good enough that you don't have 15 holding penalties Correct and it's funny because all the Years of of coaching my my coaching Background I I recently went to the Glazier coaching clinic this past year Like I'm still looking to try to get Better to help my son so I'm seeing all The High School coaches and stuff like That and they're like oh what are you What are you doing here I'm like well Coach I said now when I'm in the middle Of the field and you call a dumb play I'm gonna look over to the sideline and Say hey why'd you call that what Right you you took the same notes I did Dude like that's on you yeah why why Would you take a time out there coach That was dumb yeah like you just you're The worst coach ever you do you Know so yeah we're not allowed to do That in the games to the coaches so it's And how I can only imagine I mean and That was always my fight with it like I'd be coaching like the kids on the Field I'd be like dude you got to look For this and like I just wouldn't be Able especially if I was like the back Judge just sitting back there doing this I'd be like buddy you got to run a Better route like why is your coach Calling that like it's just I get it I Get it but I just think more football Knowledge you guys have I think the
Better yeah no I I agree and that that Was one of the things that uh that I Enjoyed it was definitely a mind shift Going from the coaching aspect to the Officiating aspect and and just like you Guys as coaches you're trying to focus If you're a position coach you're trying To focus on your position and your key And stuff like that and I used to be an Offensive coordinator so I was watching The whole offense and then going back Now all right now I'm a position I coach Again I'm watching my keys my set of my Set of linemen different things like That so it's it it was a mindset changed But I used to be an offensive lineman I Was an o line coach and tight ends coach So me being in the middle of the field There and watching the old lineman I'm Home I'm in my home area so I I I know I Can't tell you how many times playing Safety at high school I had to move that Back like buddy you gotta go this way Man like I got I can't see through you Bro yep and I I like to officiate Myself by talking to the kids first Absolutely when I see when I see the Hold early in the game going over 76 you Got to keep your hands inside move your Feet like different things like that and Especially at the at the JB and the Freshman level and when you get down to The youth levels like I don't even want A flag with me on the field like I would
Rather walk into the Huddle and explain To the kid Hey listen Friday nights That's going to be called you need to do This coach 56 is doing this I said I'd Rather not throw a flag on you like this Is still learning level I know everybody Wants to win but you also want to learn To play Friday nights and Saturday Afternoons as opposed to Thursday and Monday like let's teach these kids up And if I can help in that aspect as an Official I want to do that I I don't Want to be flag happy and throw them all The time right because an explanation Coming from the guy in the stripes right Now some coaches take that offensively Like hey don't talk to my guys it's like Buddy yes we're all on the same damn Team here like Relax He's explaining it To our guy better than probably we can Explain it or it's something we've never Explained before they never have seen Before that's why I love doing JV man It's like the best people can't stand it I love it I used to love it too I we Used to draw plays up in the dirt and Yeah like you're on the B like hey buddy You're doing this you're doing coach Well we're gonna figure it out you're Gonna do it today like you know on the Bus can anybody kick it's the learning Aspect of it yep you um I'm curious what Can be done to help officials do their Job better like is there something
That's a great question Dave is there Like so obviously you're out you guys Out there you have your crew of six and But what are some of the tools that they Could start to give like I'll use for Example like I guess some places use Instant replay right like what are Things that can continue to help of Officials in high school do their job Even better so so recently I want to say This is the second or the third year now The state of New Jersey is now put Together we're doing seminars every Other week now we're doing these online Zoom meetings now by the state of New Jersey that's being run um we're Utilizing huddle um so I go back and I'm Watching all of my my games to see if I Missed something whatever my positioning Was my keys and as a crew we're then Texting back and forth hey take a look At uh play 97 so we're starting to dive More into the technology and still Working working year round like I said W With with these we're meeting every Other week um usually Tuesdays or W or Wednesday nights and it's a it's a zoom Meeting but we're breaking down film and Going over we had one recently that was Just about holding where we had one Where we broke off into different Zoom Rooms and as umpires it was just umpires From around the state talking about Different rules and different things
That we're seeing and and how we can Continue contined to improve excuse me Problem talking there um but yeah it's Just a matter of of staying in the books Um summertime comes one of the reason Why I enjoyed refereeing over over Football is I live down by the shore so I get to go to the beach and have my Rule books and and sit there and and Read the book instead of uh driving an Hour to go to weight training and stuff Like that so it freed up it freed up Some family time but my nose is still in The books I'm still trying to read um Stay up to date with what's going on and Just trying to stay in touch with people Um W with with the podcast that I've got Going right now my whole goal is to try To just bring more awareness to Officials to coaches like I'm talking With coaches I'm trying to get players On um I I got guys from the from the Rules committee from Indiana Indianapolis that I'm gonna have on just To try to bring more knowledge and to Keep the game going and understand that These kids are working year round a and I I want the game to be the reward for Their hard work that they've done so I Want to do the best that I can so that They don't know I'm there so like I want To not be seen I want to talk and have This but I don't want them to say oh That that that Mike D is a pain in the
Ass we know him we walk in he's gonna Throw seven holding penalties things Like that I I want to give the kids the Reward for all the hard work that They're doing year round doing the seven On sevens doing the weight training do Doing all the that they're doing Offseason I don't want to cheat them so I I think just staying in the books Getting involved doing other stuff doing Some seven on seven tournaments uh in The offseason staying involved in that And even again going to the coaching Clinics and just seeing the coaches Building a rapport with the coaches Where I now know I can go up to a coach And talk to them and give them hey coach I didn't see it or coach this is what I Saw this is why I didn't call it as Opposed to uh the old school mentality And being combative and saying that Because that's what I said and uh that's Not my personality that's not my crew's Personality um but some coaches have That in their mind preemptively that Okay this guy's against us so I started Get yelled at when I was coaching after Winning 49 nothing so now when I have The stripes on I kind of just fig figure I'm gonna get yelled at by somebody so Uh it was an easy transition for me so But yeah just just stay studying is is There Um uh there's always talk about like
Shortage of officials like is there is There a difficulty getting officials to Do football and and what what are the Contributing F factors to that if if That is the case yeah our our numbers Really really dropped uh initially Because of co co was the first uh first Thing that really really hurt us I mean And I'll I'll admit it when I was Officiating the games during Co I was Masked up I had gloves on I had an Electric whistle I did I didn't know I Was like what I'm gonna take whatever Precaution I can here right um where a Lot of officials did opt out at that Point um and unfortunately didn't come Back so the numbers started dropping There we're seeing uh um we are now in New Jersey and and the Shore area we are Actually seeing a little bit of an Uptick now in the last year or so with With uh getting new Cadets in there but We got to a point where we were having So many Friday night games we weren't Have we didn't have enough Crews right Um so it it it was something that was Difficult and our our signer would would Try to contact some of the ads and they Were like listen can you guys move a Game to Saturday we know you have the Lights and you want the Friday Night Lights we don't have enough Crews or the Crew that you're gonna Get a mixed crew yeah so um it put a
Strain on on our signer in that aspect Numbers and and it's National right now The numbers it's not just select here It's not just in the state it's all over Yeah and I I'll admit myself I stopped Doing the the youth games because Initially when I was doing the youth Games uh some of the some of the towns Would have 12 coaches on the sidelines For 20 kids and we would have three Officials on the field trying to watch 22 kids and Daddy was watching his son Be held on the far sideline of a toss Sweep coming to the near sideline that We weren't calling and I'm Like matter yeah we're triangulating the Ball we're watching the ball what Happens backside we'll keep an eye out For safety but those guys well they Watch a game on Sunday afternoon so they Thought they knew everything of course And it got to be to a point where it was More of a hassle and then I got involved In coaching my own son so that that kind Of kept me out of officiating the youth One but yeah we're we're still looking And that's that's another reason Reon Why I'm I'm doing what I'm doing right Now with the with the podcast and stuff Like that and trying to jump on with you Guys is I want to bring awareness and And and I want to recruit I want to get Those guys coming out of coming out of College I mean right the
Percent well go into coaching too like I'm not saying that but with the Officiating unless you're a coach and You're going into education or something Like that you might not be able to do The time that you have where officiating You could show up on a Friday night on a Saturday afternoon where you're out of Your job um so it's it's something to Consider with with the college guys that Are graduating that if you still want to Be involved in the sport having the Playing knowledge having that background Is something great so that's I'm trying To bring awareness to that to to still Recruit and get those young guys those Energetic guys out there with us I mean I'm uh I'm an old offensive linan so my Body's feeling it and being an Umpire in There I still feel it every once in a While I got safe from the Back that makes sense does the um the NGA or or or I don't know the groups That do the assigning officials do they Ever reach out to college colleges and Like to me that would be uh a slam dunk Like I I just off the top of my head I Think those guys that work in the Recreation not just guys who were you Know maybe played football or whatever That might want to do it but but Literally the the the guys that work in Recreation right the inir right they're Already doing some of this stuff they're
Already like reing games like flag games And they kind of have some experience With it as as a student and I I always Wondered why they don't go and just Start getting those guys like like Recruiting them like on cruise no yeah Like so I don't know like so like as a Seventh guy right that's this is the guy That's training he's not making any Calls per se but he's shadowing um so You have that's kind of what they do now Right like if you get into it as a Cadet Like you got to do some games where You're literally just holding the the Sticks on the sideline but there's no Young guys there's no young gu they're All almost all of them are older because None of them want to go and only make $50 a game I don't know about that I Like I don't know about those Recreation Kids who are doing it in college I I Think those guys do they don't Understand the Avenues available to them They don't like I wouldn't know how you Know I I I know officials because we Have them at our seven and S so I would Know who to talk to but like most people Do not know who to talk to yeah so they Recently again the last couple years Have started really promoting stuff on Social media and stuff like that but Unless you're tagged or unless you're Following certain social media Avenues You might not see those but yeah the
State is recruiting the state uh our our Specific chapter we have uh somebody That's assigned to to recruiting and Talking to people and trying to get People um and our Cadet number for this Year I think we're in the 20s which is That was that that was what signed up Now their first class I think was last Week so I don't know how many people Actually showed it up for the first Class but the they we had over 20 just Sign up and and this past graduating Class if you want to say it was our Biggest one in a long time also so we're Seeing our numbers go up we are Recruiting and trying to get the younger Guys Um but yeah I I agree I I'm talking with Uh coach Garrett possibly going up there Myself and sitting down with the team And yeah talk trying to reach out to Different colleges and stuff like that And just trying to get those young guys And just get the awareness out there of This is what we do that this is this is The money that you can make but it's Again I do it because I love football Like right the the money the money helps I'm not going to lie I'm not going to Turn that down but I mean we've done the The the Phil Sims north south game the Last two years my crew and that's that's Free we do that for the love of the game We have some fun
And not should be that's what that game Should be so uh it's just it's a matter Of getting out there getting experience Seeing it and still staying involved in The sport like I said it's something That that you can still be a part of the Sport I still get amped up on Friday Nights like hell yeah from from my Playing days to my coaching days to now I when I'm in the middle of the field And I'm talking to the kids and you got The good music playing in the background I'm bouncing around still a little bit I'm getting myself amped up I I still Love the atmosphere give me a great High School band like I love that stuff so I'm still involved in the game and I'm Bringing my kid there and he's seeing it And he's falling in love with it so it's Something that uh yeah it's a lot of fun And it's still even even getting yelled At again I did it before you got to know To take what to accept and dra line and Most of the coaches understand that and Let's go play football Right it it makes makes 100% sense um I I I just think that there is an Avenue There because the young People um are looking for opportunities And they don't have jobs are different Than they are they were in the past so Yep you know uh they're they're going to Need other ways to make extra money and Guys that are involved in the game you
Know in the past that's that's a Hu I Think it's a huge Avenue because uh Because of that fact and and I do think That like yeah the colleges I mean those Kids they don't know nothing so like you If you're actually out there working With saying Hey listen you know uh in The fall season you're talking 12 12 Weeks you can make uh a few thousand Dollars more in your pocket you know Easily easily and you're putting that in Your pocket dude whatever you're doing And that's like that's a huge supplement To it that's uh um you know over the Course of 10 20 years that's that's a Good amount of extra money but um well It's it's been great having you on any Last things you want to leave us with That that that that we could remember From an officiating Standpoint uh listen we're a recent Episode that I just had we were talking About replay and I know you guys Mentioned it before for we're in the State we don't have replay system Anymore um we we had it but we don't Have it anymore I wouldn't be surprised If you're going to start seeing it again Coming uh coming down the road because Unfortunately what happened with the Basketball game recently oh yeah oh he We just uh understand that that that That we're human we're out there trying To give the best experience for the kids
Um we're trying to make it as best as Possible so we're going to make mistakes We're going to miss a call here and There we're going to make a call that You might not like but again the parents The the coaches you we all make calls in Life that we don't like or or that get Somebody upset it's the human element And we just ask that you that everybody Understands that that hey we're we're Human too and and we make mistakes try Not to But why did they get rid of the replay I Was Curious the technology oh it was wasn't Okay yeah so with New Jersey was uh was One of the experimental groups of just Using huddle so you had the end zone View and then the 50 yard line View and The referee was looking at an iPad on The sideline for a call um but then we Had two scenarios uh back in 21 in the In the college game um I'm sorry in the Championship games up at ruter that were Two very big calls that could have won Either way that replay didn't turn that People's cell phones well too I think Yeah the cell phones had another had a Better angle of it that the replay Official didn't have that view so they Couldn't change the call one way or the Other Um but so yeah so because of that just The technology aspect of it just wasn't
Wasn't there where now with huddle Having the integrated uh scoreboard That's integrated on huddle with some of The schools that think you're going to Start seeing again especially with Timing issues and stuff like that you Might start seeing that come back Especially in playoff aspects Definitely that and the play clock right Like and play clock I think that's like Such a big thing I wish schools could Have one you know oh only I only know of One school right now in our area that Has one for the varsity game so it's uh It's yeah but again just like the shot Clock argument and everybody in the South has it everybody in the South has A play clock In The End Zone I don't understand why They Don't To some schools you're talking about Some schools that can barely have Footballs and and that's I I don't buy The money aspect of that like how are These schools in the inner city that Probably don't have that much money Doing it how how are I can not doing it It's basically when if they just mandate It if they just mandate it everyone will Find money pay for those schools that Can't afford it and then the taxes are Going to go up and there you go so we're Taxes are going to go up regardless in
New Jersey that's politics brother That's politics we live that's a whole Different Discussion going up in New Jersey uh Murphy decided to tag uh 2 now it's 220 On the on the toll on theway y make3 Just make your1 what does it matter you Know what does it matter Anymore yeah but yes so that but yeah I Mean I think that you're right though The play clock is it listen one of my Beefs uh used to be because I ran to no Huddle I used to have a huge beef on the Play clock my team goes they R they run I run an no huddle the ball gets set I Got my 25 uh by seconds right yeah uh And and and the uh the other team what What is how many how many seconds is it Between plays I forgot it's 40 and 40 And 25 so it depends on what stopped the Clock What stopped the clock so T right So no huddle would end up only basically Happen that that 25 a lot of times and Yeah the teams that huddle they wouldn't Roll the clock until those guys get into The Huddle comes in and it would drive me Nuts it would it was one it was like why Why am I running the no huddle you know Like the whole point of it and I feel Like now there may be obviously a lot of Officials now that are getting more and More on board with it but it used to it Used to be one of my sore spots was the
No running a no huddle versus Team teams Would sit on the ball in the Huddle like I and I I remember we would play hell I'd be running no huddle okay and then They would take forever to get into the Huddle take forever to get the play on I Would watch a minute plus tick off you Know and and before the next play you Know that that was one of my pet peeves It used to drive me bonkers and I could Never get an answer for why it was why Why are they who's moving slower explain That one to me so so the rule is when The play ends and you'll see the Official put their hand up that they They've got the spot so when the play Ends it's basically 40 seconds from that Time so each each team gets 40 seconds If the play if there's a stoppage in the Play because of a penalty or something Like that it's going to be 25 seconds Once we blow the ready for playay Whistle so it's th those are the basics Of of what the timing rule is um I can't Lie to you some people have a 45 second Clock as opposed to a 40c clock um it it It's it depends on the crew and and Who's on the watch uh and when when Going to restart it and the funny thing Is is I had a coach complaining to us One time that was up by 30 points oh my God come on dude and that that he's like They're taking too long in the hotel I'm Like coach that's your team yeah be like
That's you guys don't you want the clock To to take a little bit more time to get Out of here at this point in time you're Already getting embarrassed what are we Doing So yeah that's that's one of the always Well that changed too this year right The uh the the mercy rule right like if You go up now I think it's just stays no Matter what even if you score a Touchdown and close the gap right it's Just going to be once you hit that point Where you're up by I believe it's what 3 33 33 it stays in the clock stays Running go and score a touchdown and now It's not 33 anymore I think it in this Yeah in the Second right yeah why CH still get a Shot in the beginning I got it remember Years ago in the state championship game Um Ramapo was down 35 points and came Back to win the game in a state Championship game so now I don't know State championship game they might allow It I don't know but but I Wonder I mean that's such a rare thing That happens but I guess technically it Could happen right A team's up 33 points A team scores seven Somehow they got in a they got in a role At but really there's no time to really Come back now so so it's it's obviously It must be a safety thing is is what was Happening is you'd get the those blowout
Games and that's when some kids would Start taking plays off and then all of a Sudden they're they're rolling their Ankle and right it it for the the the Ramapo scenario is is a very small Percentage of what happened it was more So okay team up by 42 points in the Second half now a team scores a Touchdown and now we're going back to a Regular clock again when both teams have Their JV squads in there and that's when Somebody ends up breaking a leg or Something worse so was just like ah this It didn't need to happen type of Scenario got yeah that makes sense no I Figured it was the safety safety deal Yeah I fig I figured that yeah it's only The second half if it happens in the First half it's still a regular clock so You keep on rning it up on people listen I a't worried about blowing anybody out If anything I'm worried about the other Side like let's keep this thing running Buddy yeah yep no no no doubt cool that This was awesome thanks so much for Coming on mik really I appreciate you Guys having on really what's the podcast What's what's podcast yeah plug your uh Plug your podcast go ahead bud yeah yeah So so the podcast is called Whistle talk Uh Inside the Mind of a football Official but you could search it up uh Mike D the referee is my my tagline um And again I I've got from officials to
Coaches I'm actually interviewing Tomorrow a gentleman from Southern California had a guy on from Alabama Last week so and some some New Jersey Guys some coaches and stuff like that so I'm just trying to just trying to get The word out there hopefully educate Some people uh remind some other Officials uh and to recruit so uh it's a Whistle talk it's on all the major Podcast uh platforms so uh take a listen Comment on it give me a me some reviews Uh I I'm an official I got thick skin so Say Mike what the hell are you talking About Ain't Nothing Gonna penetrate that You need those five stars that brings The views up you need those five stars Yeah give me those five Stars and then tell me tell me why you Hate me as an official like let me know And you could tell me you hate me just Give me five stars that's fine that's it Rate him and Go hey Mike really appreciate you though Taking the time uh I know we wanted to Get this done to just get a little bit Of a different angle for you know for Our viewers and whatnot and you know we Figure [ __ ] we these guys spend enough Time screaming at this guy we might as Well actually go inside his head and you Know talk to him about it so really Appreciate you taking the time buddy no Absolutely and I'm always going to be
Here for you guys if you guys ever have Uh other questions or whatever please Feel free to reach out I mean like I Said I'm still trying to teach the game No matter what side of the ball I'm on I'm still trying to teach the game and Make it better for everybody if I can Awesome man you guys thanks a lot thanks Mike have a great day you too guys thank You you Too that was great I learned a lot I Learned a lot that that that that was That that was me Mike key my I I wanted To learn I wanted to learn because dude I don't want to be an official Ever well I think that there are I Really do think like if you remember Like um we did it was a couple years ago It was the year you weren't working with The beasts but you did the the the Events so um we had to out of seven Tournament And uh the guy who does our the Officials he I don't I think we took Four full fields and he just didn't have Enough I don't think he had like enough Cruise right so we we I got like some of Those kids from like the local college Or whatever and they refereed it and They were they were like ah at first but Then they they kind of got into it like Yeah like that was kind of my like thing Like until they do it right you're Really no right like and I definitely
Agree with you if you can go to colleges And you see these guys out there reing You know uh their inter mural flag League right like hey buddy maybe you Want to think about doing this like I Mean listen you can make some B you gotta work right like you gotta Hustle if you have a good crew I mean Think about it you're talking you're Getting a game Friday night right you're Getting a Saturday afternoon game right Then Sunday you can go and do many youth Games and then Monday you grab a JV game Right or Th some of these some of these teams do Freshman games on Thursdays I didn't Even think about that you're 100% right Like you could be working five days a Week five days a week right and you Really and you if you're a football guy For the most part you just have to do it In the fall and then and then you know Maybe do seven on seven here and there Spring like winter okay yep and then hey I go and do 7 OD sevens in the spring And early summer to get ready to go yeah No doubt very cool very cool stuff well Interesting all right well we'll we We'll get off this was a great great Podcast good good viewership again and Uh um we'll go from there next week Everybody wants to know why referees are Everybody wants to hit on a referee That's right we next week we got a
Pretty busy week a few days those of you Guys follow us few days of of podcast at Least next week thir spring break Gotta Love spring break teachers and coaches Are free they're like what can I do yeah Exactly come on come on and then uh and Then we got a big one in two weeks man And then in two weeks we're gonna have One That well we'll get that promoted in due Time but that might be an all-timer um Until next time yeah until next time see You later have a good One what
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